Friday, March 27, 2015

Digging for Poof of this von der Burg Royalty.......

Birth: 1704 Abt
    Peter & Walter (Valentine) names are spelled Fonderburgh on the ship list of "The Thistle". Page 122 in the book. John Wilson, Commander, from Rotterdam, last from Plymouth, England.

SOURCE: STRASSBURGER, RALPH BEAVER.     U.S. and Canada, Passenger and Immigration Lists Index, 1500s-1900s
    1738 Age: 34
    Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    1738, 19 September, Peter and Walther (Valantin) land in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania on the ship "The Thistle". Their names appear as Peter & Valentin FONDERBURH in the book called "A Collection of Thirty Thousand Names of German, Swiss, Dutch, French, etc....Listed as Peter Von der Borg/Founderburgh-* From name written by clerk.

 Death: 1793 Abt ? Age: 89
    Baltimore, Maryland?
    **This has not been proven**

Additional Information: I volunteer on a website called "Gen Gathering". It's a global gathering of researchers and genealogists who are willing to assist with finding a record for you. But I have also added my resources so I can in turn do searches at my local courthouse, library, cemetery, etc, for others searching families in my area.
 I have been in touch with someone in Germany, through this website,  who is trying to help me locate something that will link Peter and Walther to a father and a birthplace for these two men. I have become a bit skeptical of this "royalty" link with the von der Burg's and I am in search of some tangible documentation for our research. There are just too many gaps in the Adolph theory. This being told that there is at least 8 or 9 generations of Adolph's does not jive with me. So, I cannot honestly put this information out there for the public to believe. Below is information this person is sending me.

Let me start by giving you some background info.

Burg - fortress, castle (pron. Boorg)
Berg - hill, mountain (pron. Bayrg)
Schloss - castle, palace (pron. Shlohss)
von - of (pron. like phone)
der/den/dem - the

The use of "von" generally denoted nobility and was used with place names. Based on what you've told me so far, it sounds like your ancestors' names were originally "von der Burg," as opposed to "von den/dem Berg." As you can see, BURG and BERG are pronounced very differently in German, though the anglicized pronunciation would not differentiate. The V in "von" is pronounced like an American F, so it make sense that it was transcribed as such. Similarly, in different German dialects, the following letters are interchangeable in pronunciation: B/P; U/O; K/G; V/F; V/W, to name a few.

Keeping that in mind, there are many, many place names in Germany that contain BURG or BERG, not counting variations in spelling. There are fewer places that are just BURG or BERG, but also quite a few. Most likely, your name reflects a family that was either from the BURG (fortress, castle) or worked there.

Being Lutherans from the Palatinate would generally match the historical immigration patterns of the time. As for the claims to nobility, that is difficult to discern. Yes, their name did contain the tell-tale "von," however, there are examples of names that contain the "von" merely as a grammatical additive (ie. to denote someone who worked in a castle), which is most likely the case here. It sounds like the author of your book got a little bit carried away without taking into consideration the widespread use of the words BURG and BERG in the German language, nor the strong difference in pronunciations.

You mentioned "Hessecastle." I'm assuming you're referring to a castle in the German region of Hesse(n)? There are many castles in Hessen, and even some outside of Hessen named "Hessen Castle."

Engelbert II (based on German sources I could find online) was born in a castle named "Schloss Burg" (yes, the name is slightly redundant in German), near Solingen. He held the title of "Count of Berg" (German: Graf von Berg). Upon his death, the country passed to a cousin and was then ruled by the Limburg family (as opposed to the Berg family previously). Engelbert II was murdered on his way to consecrate a church as Archbishop of Cologne. He does not appear to have any recorded children, which is supported by the fact that, upon his death, the small principality passed on to his brother-in-law. Thus, you may be related, but not likely descended from him.

My personal opinion is that the VON DER BURG family is not related to the VON BERG family mentioned above. It sounds like an uneducated attempt to link two orthographically related names. That being said, genealogy can dig up some very wild things and sometimes the truth is stranger than fiction.

Either way, it's just speculation unless you can find the birth place of one of the von der Burg brothers. Can you resend me the personal data on both brothers, please?
In which I sent back this:
Adolf is suppose to be the father of Peter & Walther. But I question
that as not one person down the lines had EVER named a son Adolf.
Walther had named his first son Lazarus and his second son Daniel.
This info is from his book. Walther was born abt 1715 probably
Prussia, Hesse-Cassel, or the Palatinate. Walther apparently went back
to Germany and married Catherina Stoll of Brandenburg in 1743.

Another passage in the book I have: Henry born 1723 was born probably Hesse
or the Paltinate, and was brought to America by his father, Peter.
(Henry was a brother to my Anthony, both sons of Peter. Anthony is my
line). Anthony was born 1727  probably Hesse and taken to Holland and
later to Ireland. So I am led to believe that they left Germany
between 1723 and 1727 if his dates are correct.

From what I can tell, my Peter born 1704 in Rheinland-Pfalz,
Germany . So I don't know if this birthplace for Peter is correct and
anywhere near where Walther was born.

Also take note that Peter named his first two sons Henry and Anthony.
A while back I found this record and while it is a christening date it
is so close to Peter's son, Anthony. The father's name, John Michael,
has been carried on in families.
        Name:   Joannes Antonius Von Der Burg
        Gender:         Male
        Baptism Date:   30 Jan 1726
        Baptism Place:  Cöln, Rheinland, Preußen, Germany
        Father:         Joannes Michael Von Der Burg
        Mother:         Maria Adelheidis Steinbuchel
        FHL Film Number:        187126